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In this episode of the series with explores from Changemakers expedition, Julia speaks with identical twins Maryam and Nivaal, who often lead together as one voice. They share how their approach to leading has evolved sometimes converging, sometimes diverging and how they balance respect for each other’s strengths with the need to make joint decisions.

The conversation explores a central dilemma for leaders: if you never listen, you risk mistakes and isolation; if you listen to everyone, you risk paralysis. Maryam and Neval talk candidly about how they’ve learned to find the balance, from setting boundaries around feedback to recognizing when to say no, and creating structures that make input meaningful rather than overwhelming.

Listen to this episode to explore how to find your own voice as a leader while still creating space for others and how to balance inclusion with clarity when making tough decisions.

About the Guest

Maryam and Nivaal Rehman

Maryam and Nivaal Rehman became activists when they were eight years old, and started inspiring girls in their village in Pakistan to continue their education, when poverty was leading them to quit school and work instead. The now 18-year-old twins have since worked in their local and global community for causes including girls’ education in Pakistan and around the world, climate justice, gender equality and inclusivity. They even have their own non-profit, The World With MNR, that uses advocacy, storytelling and development to take action and inspire others to do the same.They are continuing their activism through volunteering, traveling and sharing their experiences through their social media and their YouTube channel, The World With MNR. They’ve used their platform to cover several events — from the Social Good Summit in New York City, to the Girl Up Leadership Summit in Washington, D.C. — and interview global figures, including Prime Minister Justin Trudeau, Nobel Prize laureate Malala Yousafzai, and Madame Christine Lagarde, President of the European Central Bank. Their activism has led to recognition in media and several awards, including the Governor General’s Caring Canadian Award (now the Sovereign’s Medal for Volunteers). Most recently, they released their documentary on the status of girls’ education in Pakistan, and held global screenings to spark further conversation and inspire audience members to take action themselves.

About the Host

Julia Middleton

Julia Middleton is the host of the Women Emerging podcast and a best-selling author of “If that’s leading, I’m in” as well as two previous books: “Leading beyond Authority” and “Cultural Intelligence”. She is deeply committed to helping people from all backgrounds to find their own approach to leading.

In 2020, Julia launched Women Emerging and in 2022 she lead an expedition of 24 women to find ‘an approach to leading that resonates with women’. She now leads expeditions with women all over the world based on 4Es methodology, discovered in the first expedition.

Prior to that, Julia was founder and, for over thirty years, Chief Executive of Common Purpose, which grew to become one of the biggest leadership development organisations in the world.
Julia is also an Ambassador for the Aurora Prize based in Armenia, on the boards of Alfanar Venture Philanthropy in the Arab World and Equality Now, which operates globally, and on the Advisory Councils of Fundacao Dom Cabral in Brazil and Synapse in Pakistan.

Born in London and brought up in New York, Julia was educated at French Lycées and graduated from the London School of Economics. She is married, with five children and lots of grandchildren.